The Other Side

For the discussion of any other tabletop games. e.g. Malifaux, Dropzone Commander, Infinity etc.
komura
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Re: The Other Side

Post by komura » Wed Dec 14, 2016 10:53 pm

@Primarch @TOD

Thank you for your advice. I prefer to Abyssinia faction. But I'll wait backing this project till next January.

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Primarch
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Re: The Other Side

Post by Primarch » Thu Dec 15, 2016 12:46 am

The Other Dave wrote:In my (to be fair, fairly limited and mostly from the sidelines) experience with kickstarters, I kind of think modest stretch goals are a good sign - lots of stretch goals tend to slow things down in the fulfillment stage. *coughHawkcough*
True, but I don't need to pre-order a game. If Wyrd (or anyone) expects me to fork out a large sum of money in one go then they ought to offer me some incentive to do so. Upgrading a rulebook to a hardcover (which increases shipping weight) doesn't quite scratch the KS itch.
So I'll hold off to see if any decent Stretch Goals get unlocked.
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The Other Dave
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Re: The Other Side

Post by The Other Dave » Thu Dec 15, 2016 12:59 am

Primarch wrote:True, but I don't need to pre-order a game. If Wyrd (or anyone) expects me to fork out a large sum of money in one go then they ought to offer me some incentive to do so. Upgrading a rulebook to a hardcover (which increases shipping weight) doesn't quite scratch the KS itch.
So I'll hold off to see if any decent Stretch Goals get unlocked.
Oh, I agree completely. I like to wait and see what actual rules are like anyway unless I'm super stoked about something. The downside of the current wargames explosion is quite a few games with nice models but half-baked rules.
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Miniatures painted in 2019:
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Age of Sigmar / Shadespire: 50 Infantry, a bunch of terrain
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me_in_japan
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Re: The Other Side

Post by me_in_japan » Thu Dec 15, 2016 2:52 am

Primarch wrote:
The Other Dave wrote:In my (to be fair, fairly limited and mostly from the sidelines) experience with kickstarters, I kind of think modest stretch goals are a good sign - lots of stretch goals tend to slow things down in the fulfillment stage. *coughHawkcough*
True, but I don't need to pre-order a game. If Wyrd (or anyone) expects me to fork out a large sum of money in one go then they ought to offer me some incentive to do so. Upgrading a rulebook to a hardcover (which increases shipping weight) doesn't quite scratch the KS itch.
So I'll hold off to see if any decent Stretch Goals get unlocked.
I've had some time now to look through this KS, and to be honest I'm fairly happy with it. I've backed a fair few kickstarters (um...6 or 7?) and had varying degrees of success. The successful ones that delivered the goods on time all had very, very modest stretch goals (hardback books being a standard first stretch goal, with extra pages being another.) Bigger KSs like Raging Heroes pull in a lot of money and generate a lot of hype (Kingdom Death: Monster 1.5, anyone?) but inevitably run woefully, wooooooeeeefully over their time frame. For example the first RH KS ran well over a year late, and the current one is also getting ridiculous. Both pale in comparison to the Imbrian Arts KS, which is at 4 years late and counting (I contacted the creator directly and got a bunch of alternative minis in lieu of my pledge. That's where my Frostgrave gobbos came from.)

Backer entitlement is a massive, massive problem with Kickstarters, and can actually sink a company (see: Studio McVey and Sedition Wars). The Dropfleet Commander KS is plagued by people who made assumptions, got pissed off, take everything personally, and Will Not Go Away, turning every single facebook post (by anyone, on any topic) into their own personal rant at Hawk. It leaves a very sour taste in the mouth, and the poor mods have no idea what to do. Hawk, for their part, seem genuinely bothered by it, and are trying to please all the people all the time, with limited success. Most of the problems on the Hawk KS come from how the ship dates were handled, which themselves were very badly affected by the number of stretch goals and how they were produced.

I actually really like how Wyrd have approached this. Rather than offer unrealistic (low) targets, busting out tons of disingenuous freebie unlocks as they proceed, they've built in the discount to the basic pledge levels. Half a Dual Commander will be 150USD, for which you get an allegiance box (RRP 125USD), a titan (RRP 90USD) and a rulebook (RRP 60USD), for a total saving of 125USD. That's not bad at all. That's your freebie right there. A 125USD Allegiance box set. Yes, buying from some online site would reduce RRP, but not by 125 bucks.

Overall I'm actually quite interested in this. I have yet to watch the gameplay video, but aesthetically I'm really liking it. Were a few of us to buy in at Commander level, I reckon it could provide a nice, level playing field for getting stuff painted and games played. If it turns out to be a sucky game (unlikely), 150USD (plus shipping, granted) is not such a huge risk. Heck, I spend that on my weekly shopping.

tl/dr - This is a fair and up-front KS, where you can save 125USD on RRP. Freebies are icing, but this is a nice cake.

*edit* The gameplay video is fairly comprehensive. It's basically malifaux-lite (opposed and unopposed duels, cheat fate with cards in hand, etc), with a fairly high casualty rate and a smattering of tokens that are generated and used up fairly briskly. The fireteam mechanic looks like it'll speed things up a good deal, compared to an equivalent mini count game of, say, WMH.
current (2019) hobby interests
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Nurgle daemons for AoS, Ghosties for Shadespire
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Primarch
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Re: The Other Side

Post by Primarch » Thu Dec 15, 2016 4:17 am

Yeah, there is a fair saving compared to the RRP, but even in the comments section of the KS, a lot of folks are asking 'Is this it then?'
I don't need the moon on a stick, some KS's are ruined by companies promising too much as has been said, but there should still be some incentive to hand over money and then wait for a full year (or more) to receive anything. Since everything that I could purchase now will become available through retail - perhaps at a discount - later, I am very solidly on the fence. A couple of KS exclusive minis or something useful in-game adds to the appeal. Adding a bit of blurb to the box that says "This is the xyz unit that does x and y in a z like fashion" when it should already be in the rulebook doesn't serve to ice the cake.
There are other things I need to consider as well, Reaper have their next KS in Spring 2017 and funds I use for TOS will be unavailable for that. There are a lot of Malifaux minis I would like, competing with TOS, not to mention all the other games and systems that I already collect.

TL:DR - It's not a bad deal, but it hasn't wowed me yet.
Prims Painty Points > +924.5
Finished Minis in 2014: 510.....Finished Minis in 2015: 300
Finished Minis in 2016 (as of Nov 30): 369 + 2 Tables of Terrain

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The Other Dave
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Re: The Other Side

Post by The Other Dave » Thu Dec 15, 2016 5:59 am

Speaking of models, that big chthulu with little chthulus on his back makes a pretty strong argument for considering the gibbering hordes faction...
Feel free to call me Dave!
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Miniatures painted in 2019:
40K / Kill Team: 47 Infantry
Age of Sigmar / Shadespire: 50 Infantry, a bunch of terrain
Adeptus Titanicus: 5 Titans, 6 Knights

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Primarch
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Re: The Other Side

Post by Primarch » Thu Dec 15, 2016 10:13 pm

Wyrd have posted a few updates overnight detailing the material they are using and also updating the stretchgoals a little. It looks like each faction's second command model will be added to most pledges for free once the goal is reached.

Assuming I stop being a greedy, no-good ingrate, it looks like locally we have some interest.

I'm interested in the King's Empire.
Komura san has said he is interested in Abyssinia
M_i_J and the Cult of Gribblyness seem like a forgone conclusion. :D
ToD has expressed some interest in the Hordes.
Koji hasn't said much since his first post.
Anyone else have any interest in this?
Prims Painty Points > +924.5
Finished Minis in 2014: 510.....Finished Minis in 2015: 300
Finished Minis in 2016 (as of Nov 30): 369 + 2 Tables of Terrain

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The Other Dave
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Re: The Other Side

Post by The Other Dave » Thu Dec 15, 2016 10:26 pm

I'm about 50/50 between hordes and abyssinians, actually.
Feel free to call me Dave!
-----
Miniatures painted in 2019:
40K / Kill Team: 47 Infantry
Age of Sigmar / Shadespire: 50 Infantry, a bunch of terrain
Adeptus Titanicus: 5 Titans, 6 Knights

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me_in_japan
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Re: The Other Side

Post by me_in_japan » Fri Dec 16, 2016 12:49 am

It's nice to see Wyrd are being proactive with the KS, taking various opinions into account, and jigging things around a bit to keep folks happy. Also, while I still maintain the basic pledge is a decent deal, freebie minis is not a bad thing, so I'm happy on that count. Also, those titans are bigger'n I thought. Also, also, that arcane emmisary looks mighty purdy painted up. The art didnt wow me, but seeing the mini there makes engage in a bit of chin-stroking ponderation...
current (2019) hobby interests
minis
Nurgle daemons for AoS, Ghosties for Shadespire
Magic cards
tribal zombies, Standard, too much MtGA.
Hobby finances
minis: in the black
MtG: So, so red :(

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Primarch
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Re: The Other Side

Post by Primarch » Sat Dec 17, 2016 3:38 am

The Cult got a big preview in update number 10 on the KS page. Dang those are some gribbly looking dudes.
Prims Painty Points > +924.5
Finished Minis in 2014: 510.....Finished Minis in 2015: 300
Finished Minis in 2016 (as of Nov 30): 369 + 2 Tables of Terrain

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